Thanks for the info Lini,
Ok, so for the 3 PC's I have in the house, you suggest to get 2 different external enclosure systems?
If so, what is the best way to have these "available and always on" when a user boots up there PC. I have an external harddrive @ work that sits cold and idle until I dock my laptop into the docking station that it is attached to. Then it comes to life and performs a backup of my laptop. I think this would be best as the external harddrives would sit idle, but powered on awaiting to be connected via USB for which turns them on.
.... So if I get say 2 external USB hard drives. and have them connected to a powered USB hub, this would be good for a private home user? It sounds good. And since I already have a 300gb Maxtor, all I would need is 1 more.
But... How do I keep them in sync? Am I going to be bothered with constantly updateing 1 external harddrive while the other is the "master"?
Thats why the mirroring solution was so nice looking as I wold not have to keep the 2 drives in sync.
Let me know and thanks for all the info
[JiF]Crash (Jiffer since 2002)
Need a mirrored external solution
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[JiF]Crash
- Forum User
- Posts: 76
- Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 12:45 pm
Re: Need a mirrored external solution
[JiF]Crash (Jiffer since 2002)
Re: Need a mirrored external solution
Zouga: *lol* But, no, I'm not fishing for business, as I don't sell hard- and software products. I just review these and write articles on the results (plus some news, backgrounders et cetera)...
Crash: Ohoh, this might turn into a longer conversation, 'cause it seems like a thorough introduction and overview on the back-up topic would be a good idea - but that would be quite a bit of work. But where to start then? Hmmm... I guess, for this round, I'd best tell you why I wouldn't consider some of your ideas to be good ones from a data safety point of view.
The first one is the thing with turning the back-up solution on automatically with the systems: bad idea! For one thing, if the back-up solution is always on, whenever one of your computers is on, it'll age with the computers - whereas for data safety it would be smarter to avoid unnecessary wear and only activate the back-up solution, when there actually is something to be backed up on or retrieved from it. And the other problem is, if the back-up solution is always on together with the computers, there's also as much opportunity for it as for the computers to be attacked by malware or damaged by other external causes (power spikes, software running wild, operating error...). So, while the desire for convenience sure is understandable, it rather collides with what would be good for data safety...
The other problematic idea is automatic synchronisation: There are quite a few potential problem scenarios in which this might only let you end up with the same ruined back-up twice, instead of a ruined one and a good one. I'd rather suggest alternating use.
Example usage scenario: Your three computers are all using some kind of recent Windows OS and are all equipped with one hard drive that's partitioned as one big C: drive - and luckily all three C: partitions together would easily fit onto a modern Terabyte hd. Then I'd suggest to get two different external drives and to split these into two partitions each. Now walk from computer to computer every fortnight and use a drive replicator software for saving a complete C: drive image of each computer onto the one partition of the external drive, and in addition manually save whatever you deem valuable to the other partition. Do this alternatingly, i.e. change the external drive used every fortnight. And if the external drives are big enough, you might even want to keep several generations of image and file back-ups on each one. The result would be pretty good data safety with a lot of advantages: One would be that by storing complete drive images you're not only protected from more than just user data loss, you also don't have to care where on the source drive valuable data might be stored (i.e. you can't forget anything). Another one would be that the additional file back-up provides quick random access on retrieval, e.g. in case you just unintentionally deleted a handful of files...
Greetings from Munich!
Manfred / lini
Crash: Ohoh, this might turn into a longer conversation, 'cause it seems like a thorough introduction and overview on the back-up topic would be a good idea - but that would be quite a bit of work. But where to start then? Hmmm... I guess, for this round, I'd best tell you why I wouldn't consider some of your ideas to be good ones from a data safety point of view.
The first one is the thing with turning the back-up solution on automatically with the systems: bad idea! For one thing, if the back-up solution is always on, whenever one of your computers is on, it'll age with the computers - whereas for data safety it would be smarter to avoid unnecessary wear and only activate the back-up solution, when there actually is something to be backed up on or retrieved from it. And the other problem is, if the back-up solution is always on together with the computers, there's also as much opportunity for it as for the computers to be attacked by malware or damaged by other external causes (power spikes, software running wild, operating error...). So, while the desire for convenience sure is understandable, it rather collides with what would be good for data safety...
The other problematic idea is automatic synchronisation: There are quite a few potential problem scenarios in which this might only let you end up with the same ruined back-up twice, instead of a ruined one and a good one. I'd rather suggest alternating use.
Example usage scenario: Your three computers are all using some kind of recent Windows OS and are all equipped with one hard drive that's partitioned as one big C: drive - and luckily all three C: partitions together would easily fit onto a modern Terabyte hd. Then I'd suggest to get two different external drives and to split these into two partitions each. Now walk from computer to computer every fortnight and use a drive replicator software for saving a complete C: drive image of each computer onto the one partition of the external drive, and in addition manually save whatever you deem valuable to the other partition. Do this alternatingly, i.e. change the external drive used every fortnight. And if the external drives are big enough, you might even want to keep several generations of image and file back-ups on each one. The result would be pretty good data safety with a lot of advantages: One would be that by storing complete drive images you're not only protected from more than just user data loss, you also don't have to care where on the source drive valuable data might be stored (i.e. you can't forget anything). Another one would be that the additional file back-up provides quick random access on retrieval, e.g. in case you just unintentionally deleted a handful of files...
Greetings from Munich!
Manfred / lini
Re: Need a mirrored external solution
Weren't you looking to simply combine all the "My Documents" folders from your 3 pc's and protect that folder from a drive failure when you started this thread? There's been a lot of talk online lately about how mirrored drives aren't a "true backup." I can't tell you how many times mirrored drives have saved one of my servers from being down for hours while I restored a tape backup or something. Mirroring is really the first level of a backup strategy. It's cheap, it's easy, and it does a very good job at protecting against drive failures...but that's about it.
I'm all for keeping things simple.
I'm all for keeping things simple.
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[JiF]Crash
- Forum User
- Posts: 76
- Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 12:45 pm
Re: Need a mirrored external solution
LOL,
I know .... I wasnt this simple also.
1 last time. I just want to make sure "my documents" on 3 pc's to be safe. If this just calls for eack PC to have there own ext. hard drive and I just do a incremental every few days, I guess that will be fine.
I'm not sure why I can have something that mirrors the "my doc" folder of each PC and back it up automatically.
Remember that I already have a 300 gb maxtor @ work that backs up my hard drive every time I dock it in the morning. I just thought having a single mirror system to back up all 3 Pc's my doc folders daily would be sufficient.
Crash
I know .... I wasnt this simple also.
1 last time. I just want to make sure "my documents" on 3 pc's to be safe. If this just calls for eack PC to have there own ext. hard drive and I just do a incremental every few days, I guess that will be fine.
I'm not sure why I can have something that mirrors the "my doc" folder of each PC and back it up automatically.
Remember that I already have a 300 gb maxtor @ work that backs up my hard drive every time I dock it in the morning. I just thought having a single mirror system to back up all 3 Pc's my doc folders daily would be sufficient.
Crash
[JiF]Crash (Jiffer since 2002)
Re: Need a mirrored external solution
Mike: I had already mentioned above that mirroring comes in handy for bridging the availability gap in case of single drive failures. But, as also mentioned, that's mostly relevant for commercial computing - for private use, it usually doesn't matter whether the data to be restored becomes available again an hour sooner or later...
Crash: You can do it the way you had in mind, too - it'll be better than nothing, and if you think that balance between extra safety and convenience suits to your needs, then that's certainly ok with me. I just thought your primary goal was data safety, and hence I tried to point out a better solution for that purpose...
Greetings from Munich!
Manfred / lini
Crash: You can do it the way you had in mind, too - it'll be better than nothing, and if you think that balance between extra safety and convenience suits to your needs, then that's certainly ok with me. I just thought your primary goal was data safety, and hence I tried to point out a better solution for that purpose...
Greetings from Munich!
Manfred / lini
Re: Need a mirrored external solution
Lini, I must admit I didn't read the entire thread so I don't know what you said or didn't. 
I was just struck at the amount of info this thread generated, got some pretty knowledgeable peeps in JiF! Although..I suppose the question initially seems very simple. I took the time to read your replies and I suppose your right, all I needed to say was my first sentence, you covered everything else. I'm just too lazy to read threads sometimes lol.
I was just struck at the amount of info this thread generated, got some pretty knowledgeable peeps in JiF! Although..I suppose the question initially seems very simple. I took the time to read your replies and I suppose your right, all I needed to say was my first sentence, you covered everything else. I'm just too lazy to read threads sometimes lol.Re: Need a mirrored external solution
Crash, just ran across this description of a program and thought you might be interested. Is a Top 10 freeware pick from one of the newsletters I belong too, though I'm sure there's tons of others too.
Allway Sync from Usov Lab is a convenient way to synchronize the contents of folders over a network or between internal and external storage devices attached to a single PC. It is simple to use. Select two folders, typically one data folder on your desktop PC and a corresponding folder on your laptop or backup folder on a server. The program lists new and changed files. Make some quick choices about which files to keep and which to update and the program will synchronize the folders.
Allway Sync from Usov Lab is a convenient way to synchronize the contents of folders over a network or between internal and external storage devices attached to a single PC. It is simple to use. Select two folders, typically one data folder on your desktop PC and a corresponding folder on your laptop or backup folder on a server. The program lists new and changed files. Make some quick choices about which files to keep and which to update and the program will synchronize the folders.